19 Replies to “Bad Vestments Blog”

  1. I agree that these vestments are just plain awful, but you should know that this website has a pretty clear “anti liberal Episcopal church” subtext. Very anti our female Presiding bishop. It links to one of the conservative breakaway groups. Just so you know. . . .

    [I did sort of get that, but I thought it was worth linking to him anyway. He’s downright nasty at times but the whole vestments issue really needs a good skewering, IMHO, and it’s one that I can’t give with photo evidence. And as much as I admire KJS, she has worn some *atrocious* vestments!! -PB]

  2. Ditto on Madgebaby. Not too subtle subtext of misogyny and anti-TEC sentiment there. Not that I don’t agree w/ a few of his choices, but . . . .

  3. So the first stole I see is MY stole, that I got as a gift for my ordination. I LOVE doves and balloons and see nothing wrong with that design. I loved that stole so much I used the design for my wedding. There’s nothing awful about it. [Obviously the guy’s a traditionalist, so you just go ahead and enjoy your balloons! I didn’t really see the problem with that stole but I do think he makes some important points in an acerbic way that I enjoy. – PB]

  4. Don’t forget that KJS may be wearing whatever is on offer at whichever cathedral she is presiding at on a given occasion.

    If she’s not in mitre and cope, you can almost bet that it’s the place, not her, that chose the vestments–especially if all the clergy match the altar frontal.

    When Archbishop Rowan is with us in his capacity as Archbishop of Canterbury, he wears Archbishoppy stuff–gold cope and mitre, over purple cassock and white alb.

    Last week he was with us as our Diocesan bishop, and wore one of the chasubles from our newly dedicated Ordinary Time set (which are a marvellous eucalyptus green with 3-D silver embroidery), with a plain white mitre, black cassock and white alb.

    So, cut KJS some slack–half the time, she won’t be in stuff of her own choosing, but what is supplied by the host cathedral.

  5. I also realized that KJS was on the blog several times. I do really admire her- but the vestments she wore at some occasions were simply….ugggh.

    Even if they weren´t hers- they are still quite “extravagant”.
    I wonder why churches/cathedrals choose such vestments which have to be worn by several people.
    Mind you even if the vestments are pretty ugly KJS usually makes a great figure in it. And more important- what she says is really good. That´s more important than vestments.

    When I came across this link I couldn´t resist a link from my own blog to this wonderful collection.
    For us “black-only” people it´s just wonderful to see what´s out there.

  6. Chavale, I think a lot of churches choose their vestments to work with the church–after all, the one thing the blog guy does get right is that ‘it’s not about you’ (or whoever is presiding).

    At one church that was a research site for me, all of the very contemporary vestments were designed to echo themes in the stained glass (also very modern–the church had been consecrated only a year prior to my research).

    At Canterbury cathedral, the particular green that chosen to match the only significant portion of green in the quire.

    It’s done to work with the church, which is actually not a bad principle.

  7. Wendy is correct in that she is very possibly wearing whatever is provided to her by the congregation she is visiting. people may be giving her these vestments. . . .they may not be representative of her personal taste. It could be that after her consecration, people thought they should give her stuff like that. Given how simply she dresses otherwise, I’d be surprised if it’s all her own choosing.

    I remember a Bishop saying that he had grown to despise a hymn, because word had gotten out that it was his favorite and everyone played it when he came for a visitation. He visited a different church every sunday, so he sang it every sunday. For five years. People go overboard when it comes to this sort of thing in our church.

    I cannot fathom the process altar guilds go through in picking some of the vestments they do. From chasubles that cost as much as a car to pom-pom balls and rick-rack, some are so hideous. I’m quite short, and the thing that really gets me is when a very tall person has everthing sized to fit him perfectly, thereby ensuring that everyone that comes after looks like they are playing dress-up.

  8. Also, in fairness–the bad vestments that KJS gets stuck with would never get photo’d if it wasn’t her wearing them. They’re bad whether it’s her or anyone else.

    However, SHE is the photo opportunity. The Dean of your average Episcopal cathedral isn’t a headliner in most instances. The PB shows up–and it’s the first woman to hold that office, so newsworthy for good or ill–and it is a media event.

  9. But let’s face it… there are a lot of really horrible vestments out there, and a lot of that is due to a “look at me” attitude. I’m all for expressing one’s individuality and choosing vestments that are meaningful to us, but they often distract. I’m tired of looking at rainbow tie-dye ponchos and shimmery polyester “goddess” muu-muus.

  10. Agreed that there is a lot of ecclesiastical garbage available and in use. And a lot of it is the ‘look at me’ thing (which is actually more prevalent amongst women clergy than men–and more in the US than in the UK).

    Still, I’m simply pointing out that every ghastly chasuble is not the choice of the person wearing it, and we have to distinguish between the two.

    And, of course, be just a BIT charitable when it isn’t the choice of the person involved.

  11. PeaceBang,

    Thanks for the hilarious link! So many of those choices had me in stitches. Even those who are coming from a different theological bent than the author can appreciate some of these observations, right? At any rate, I agree with your comments 100%!

  12. Yeah…once I picked up on the anti- (KJS/more open Episcopal Church) slant over on the site, it ruined it for me. Not that I can’t *learn* something from folks with whom I don’t agree, but since I was going over to the site strictly for its humor value, it doesn’t work for me.

  13. One more thing to think about–some of those big patterend vestments look sort of silly in a photo or in an average to big church, but in some of these places that could double as airplane hangars, they might work. the dainty jaquard that looks more tasteful close up would totally wash out–sort of like theatrical makeup.

  14. Thanks, PB! It seems to me that these vestments call attention to themselves and to the wearer and don’t contribute much to the worship of God. It’s also hard to figure out how multicolored vestments express one particular liturgical color. I can’t think of a liturgical season for which the color is “multi.”

  15. Look out—today they are bashing the pieced jeans stole you posted on July 10, 2009–complete with pockets!

  18. PeaceBang, I love your sass, and I love your blogs. God says he doesn’t want me for a minister yet, but we’re going to chat about it again when the kids are grown and out of the house.

    I see you have a lot to say to those who won’t be parted from their beloved t-shirts. Perhaps folks would care to convert said t-shirts into ecologically friendly reusable tote bags as shown in the following tutorial. If a couple of little boys can do it, most grown-ups probably can as well.
    http://wildonionstudio.wordpress.com/2008/06/01/tee-bags-a-tutorial-to-recycle-a-tee-shirt-into-a-shopping-bag/

  19. Wow. Hadn’t been here in a while and hadn’t seen the blog to which you linked.

    As an Episcopalian, I have to agree that the blog in question is out to get KJS. The comments in which our friend Mags (not an Episcopalian) put in a right-on word about this got really, really ugly in response to her. So I’m not inclined to revisit the blog.

    That said, of course there are some dreadful, dreadful vestments out there. The major problem seems to be 1) shape (less of an issue with the high-church folk, more with the free-church folk): lumpy is not so good and 2) too many juxtaposed colors and patterns that are too busy. (Even in churches that don’t do liturgical seasons.)

    Bear in mind that some people just don’t have a sense of style. I bet the same people with lumpy overly froufrou vestments also dress in a way that would have you in conniption fits, dear PB. They may or may not be narcissists.

    Maybe they need a good costume party or clowning class during off-hours and a sense of what is appropriate where. Remember they don’t have fashion mentors in seminaries and often people don’t get any advice, because heavens, we can’t talk about BODIES in seminary! And sartorial advice would be VANITY, horrors. It may in fact be exactly the opposite of encouraging vanity, but if these people were trained in an institution or with a mentality that discourages body talk and clothing talk, where are they going to get a sense of boundaries and taste? Nowhere.

    I must be the only person who liked KJS’s installation vestments. I loved the silk, I thought the colors were fine, and I think miters look silly no matter what and given that fact, her purple one was fine. (Though my favorite remains the one Barbara Harris had at her consecration, made of West African cloth.) I also liked this year’s Convention vestments, which I found quite elegant. The fabric flowed, the color scheme wasn’t too busy, and it was liturgically appropriate for the season of Pentecost. So sue me. I did not, however, like the rainbow stripey miter. (Rainbow stripey can work on some things and in some churches, but not that kind of stripey.)

    I also love Central American stoles which many of my clergy friends, Episcopal/Anglican and Roman Catholic, wear, and which are quite brightly colored. But they have their own integrity and with a simple alb they are wonderful. I wouldn’t wear a chasuble with them.

    I saw a lovely chasuble in the Bay Area when I was visiting this summer; it completed the pattern of the altar cloth, white with circles of color (in greens, for the season). The priest had the smallest of three concentric circles on her chasuble. So the presider became part of a whole; she was in the center, but it wasn’t about her. I’ve never seen vestments like that. I wish there were a picture somewhere.

    However, the presider put on the chasuble midway through the liturgy, which I have seen done before and I can’t stand, and also is really not liturgically okay – I know the folks who trained this person liturgically, two of the best liturgists on the planet (truly) and they never do this or encourage it. Perhaps it was a practice at this particular parish. I’ve mostly seen this done in hot climates, e.g. in Florida, and can understand it since layers do get hot, but the Bay Area is not hot, not in the particular part of it where we were. Either wear a chasuble or do the whole liturgy in alb and stole, but don’t do half and half. It’s just too weird and interruptive to wiggle into another piece of clothing right there in front of God and everyone.

    Having been picky about this and that, I must say that there are times when you have a home Eucharist or you are in a prison or in the fields (e.g. with migrant workers) where just a stole is fine and where the vessels can be simple and not match and not even be intended for liturgy, and really, so what? What really matters there? As John Shea said, gather the people, tell the story, break the bread.

    Here’s a question for all of you, though, related to the “KJS can’t always wear what she chooses” comments (which I think are accurate). What happens if one is ordained and receives as gifts some truly dreadful vestments? Or if one is installed as priest or pastor or minister at a parish where there is a dreadful set of vestments? One could hurt or offend someone (or an entire group of people) by not using the vestments, or by not using them at least once in the case of a gift. So there’s that to consider. I suspect none of the folks on that blog were in that situation and that it was more a question of their having chosen the offending stoles or chasubles, but again, what should one do if one finds what is there truly hideous? What have all y’all done about this?

    Finally, I think Jesus shows up whether or not we have bad taste or good taste, so although good taste and liturgical appropriateness are important, they aren’t the be-all and end-all, and of course neither is the presiding or preaching or officiating person, which was part of the blog’s point, and yours.

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